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Love it or Hate It (Torture Garden 2)
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XenithSanguine
#1 Posted : Wednesday, January 20, 2021 4:31:46 PM(UTC)


Rank: Rising Forum Member

Joined: 9/24/2020(UTC)
Posts: 61
Location: Mostly Arizona but travel a lot on business.
The time for this to come was inevitable.

Our team each made our own independent statement about this issue surrounding controversy involving Torture Garden & Torture Garden 2.

We invite everyone to speak on this matter, but ask that you please read our statements related to this. There are factors you might not know.

Xen's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104677098

Raven's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104692540

Kukki's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104677395


vww://utherverse.vww/@186072/torturegarden2#Start

Boo hoo! Boo hoo! Boo hoo! We are inviting these public comments by the partial recommendation of a prominent WG. Boo hoo! Boo hoo! Boo hoo!
"The one thing I will know for certain, is I will never know anything for certain."

- Xenith Sanguine
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KukkiDoll
#2 Posted : Wednesday, January 20, 2021 4:36:32 PM(UTC)

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Hello!
Hope everyone feels free to comment and have civil conversations!!
~Kukkidoll
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Mrs_Xhris_SD_1
#3 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 3:38:08 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: XenithSanguine Go to Quoted Post
The time for this to come was inevitable.

Our team each made our own independent statement about this issue surrounding controversy involving Torture Garden & Torture Garden 2.

We invite everyone to speak on this matter, but ask that you please read our statements related to this. There are factors you might not know.

Xen's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104677098

Raven's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104692540

Kukki's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104677395


vww://utherverse.vww/@186072/torturegarden2#Start

Boo hoo! Boo hoo! Boo hoo! We are inviting these public comments by the partial recommendation of a prominent WG. Boo hoo! Boo hoo! Boo hoo!



This is certainly interesting indeed. So you took the name of an RLC ICON and decided it wasn't functioning the way you would like it to therefore, you kite off the reputation and legacy of the Torture Garden?

There are so many things you could have named your new establishment, but you wanted the notoriety of the Garden to lead people to believe that this had something to do with them, thus making you more successful perhaps?

I'm sorry but if you were looking for approval I have to pass.

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Nefarious_Needs
#4 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 4:10:46 PM(UTC)


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Torture Garden has been an Icon on RLC for too long, I would just sit in Torture Garden just to listen to the various personalities that came there , The tempo of the place has changed over the years but the theme remains the same.

I got to know lots of people that came there, made friends with Masters and Mistresses and their subjects it really opened my eyes to BDSM community and got rid of some of the stereotypes I may have had with it.

To see its name misused is a slap in the face to all the hard work put into the club, Riding off of the coattails of the people who made that place is insulting.

I did stop in Torture garden 2 on it's opening night for a few just to see what it looked like, it never occurred to me it was a carbon copy of the original, oh well I guess you live and learn in this Virtual World.

Do I have a solid opinion NO I do not, but I think I will just continue to stick with the original brand?
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XenithSanguine
#5 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 10:23:54 PM(UTC)


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Originally Posted by: Nefarious_Needs Go to Quoted Post

To see its name misused is a slap in the face to all the hard work put into the club, Riding off of the coattails of the people who made that place is insulting.


We didn't originally misuse the name. I can tell you didn't read our writings as you would see the error in your statement if you did.
"The one thing I will know for certain, is I will never know anything for certain."

- Xenith Sanguine
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XenithSanguine
#6 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 10:24:56 PM(UTC)


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Location: Mostly Arizona but travel a lot on business.
Originally Posted by: Mrs_Xhris_SD_1 Go to Quoted Post



This is certainly interesting indeed. So you took the name of an RLC ICON and decided it wasn't functioning the way you would like it to therefore, you kite off the reputation and legacy of the Torture Garden?

There are so many things you could have named your new establishment, but you wanted the notoriety of the Garden to lead people to believe that this had something to do with them, thus making you more successful perhaps?

I'm sorry but if you were looking for approval I have to pass.



Pass if you wish, that's your free choice. I'll pass on a defunct club with broken features everywhere, and a salty dangerous community. To each their own. I am sorry progress offends you so much.
"The one thing I will know for certain, is I will never know anything for certain."

- Xenith Sanguine
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Mrs_Xhris_SD_1
#7 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 10:27:07 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: XenithSanguine Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Nefarious_Needs Go to Quoted Post

To see its name misused is a slap in the face to all the hard work put into the club, Riding off of the coattails of the people who made that place is insulting.


We didn't originally misuse the name. I can tell you didn't read our writings as you would see the error in your statement if you did.


Bottom line is what you are doing is wrong. As a club owner, in fact I own several clubs with my husband here. It's the absolute wrong thing to do.

I don't need to go willy nilly through links that do not work to know what's right or what's wrong. You can justify the name all you wish. You asked the question and I answered it in truth and honesty.
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KukkiDoll
#8 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 10:28:01 PM(UTC)

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Happy to see people replying to these statements! Interesting seeing different perspectives.
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XenithSanguine on 1/22/2021(UTC)
XenithSanguine
#9 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 10:35:17 PM(UTC)


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Originally Posted by: Mrs_Xhris_SD_1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: XenithSanguine Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Nefarious_Needs Go to Quoted Post

To see its name misused is a slap in the face to all the hard work put into the club, Riding off of the coattails of the people who made that place is insulting.


We didn't originally misuse the name. I can tell you didn't read our writings as you would see the error in your statement if you did.


Bottom line is what you are doing is wrong. As a club owner, in fact I own several clubs with my husband here. It's the absolute wrong thing to do.

I don't need to go willy nilly through links that do not work to know what's right or what's wrong. You can justify the name all you wish. You asked the question and I answered it in truth and honesty.


You still haven't read my writing did you? You are judging our actions based on a limited understanding of the situation. Read them please. Or just stop trolling.
"The one thing I will know for certain, is I will never know anything for certain."

- Xenith Sanguine
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Mrs_Xhris_SD_1
#10 Posted : Friday, January 22, 2021 11:11:06 PM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: XenithSanguine Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mrs_Xhris_SD_1 Go to Quoted Post



This is certainly interesting indeed. So you took the name of an RLC ICON and decided it wasn't functioning the way you would like it to therefore, you kite off the reputation and legacy of the Torture Garden?

There are so many things you could have named your new establishment, but you wanted the notoriety of the Garden to lead people to believe that this had something to do with them, thus making you more successful perhaps?

I'm sorry but if you were looking for approval I have to pass.



Pass if you wish, that's your free choice. I'll pass on a defunct club with broken features everywhere, and a salty dangerous community. To each their own. I am sorry progress offends you so much.


Taking the name of someone else's club, someone's hard work over years, and using it to make yours more successful is not progress. Change the name to reflect your originality and personality. This is what the crux of it all is.

BDSM clubs are not new to RLC but yours IS. Work for it it by providing working equipment etc. build your brand, establish your following. Do like other clubs do from the ground up with ingenuity and drive. Not kiting off someone else.

I'm not sorry I don't view this as progress. This is my honest opinion. Nothing personal. You asked for opinions and this is mine.
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rolichan
#11 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 2:24:58 AM(UTC)


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i'm sorry, but is there some rule in rlc that states that if you name your rlc club after a rl club, then your rlc club must be an exact replica of the rl one?

honestly, i wouldn't have responded to this at all (it's been a while since i went to tg, and i actually agree that it's a bit too "salty" in there for my taste), but your tone was just too sanctimonious and entitled for me to not say something.

sure, it's okay to teach others what you know about any topic. but only if they actually want you to. the whole thing about any fetish is that it's a personal choice and there is no universal right or wrong way to go about it. you like your "rules" that work for you and your partners and want to preach them yet you have no respect for the fact your rules may not work for everyone. (yes, i read your "writings" )

frankly, whether or not your club is a closer representation of an actual fetish club is irrelevant. the original rlc torture garden was there first. tg is an established club with an established following. pick another name - you're being rude.

oh, and one last thing... you do realize that the rl torture garden fetish club "stole" the name from a really old french book without making their club an exact replica of the book - right? should the copyright holder of the book go after the rl tg club since they're not being true to the book? or better yet, perhaps another group should start a rl torture garden 2 that more closely resembles the book and set up shop next door to the "original" tg?
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_leeanne_
#12 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 2:34:36 AM(UTC)


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Bahahahahaha open season on naming anything you want #2 I think it is really appropriate.

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Mrs_Xhris_SD_1
#13 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 9:43:18 AM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: _leeanne_ Go to Quoted Post
Bahahahahaha open season on naming anything you want #2 I think it is really appropriate.



If any other club decided to name themselves #2 <which there is a club II already that we own> I'd have to demand that they change the name and take proper action if they did not do so. I'm sorry, my husband and I worked hard to build our brand over the 2.5 years we've been open and welcome others to do the same. But not take our name.
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SuperDave_1
#14 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 9:54:12 AM(UTC)

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As a fellow club owner I can appreciate the want and need to provide another option to the RLC Community in an area one feels is most lacking. I can appreciate wanting to educate and inform others of topics they may not fully understand or be aware of. I can understand the need to want to prove that a place can potentially be better than another is. BUT to give the name of a club the exact same name as a different club and add a "#2" at the end of it WITHOUT THE CONSENT OR APPROVAL OF THE OWNERS OF THE ORIGINAL CLUB is irresponsible AND immoral. Regardless of the situation if this were the real world the owners of the original TG could sue all of you for copyright infringement AND infringement on intellectual property to say the least. You wanted to create buzz and curiosity for your establishment I can appreciate that as well BUT not like this. TG has worked so hard to build a name for itself for as long as I've been here (since September 2007). They may have taken the idea from a book as a source of inspiration but have made it their own. Agree to disagree here. You want to run a club based on a lack of morals and ethics that's your choice. My choice is not to support your establishment. I will continue to support the original TG and will ask those that I know AND respect to support the original TG as well.
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Bad_Timmy
#15 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 10:46:33 AM(UTC)


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Originally Posted by: XenithSanguine Go to Quoted Post
The time for this to come was inevitable.

Our team each made our own independent statement about this issue surrounding controversy involving Torture Garden & Torture Garden 2.

We invite everyone to speak on this matter, but ask that you please read our statements related to this. There are factors you might not know.

Xen's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104677098

Raven's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104692540

Kukki's Statement: https://www.utherverse.c...mp;BlogOwnerId=104677395


vww://utherverse.vww/@186072/torturegarden2#Start

Boo hoo! Boo hoo! Boo hoo! We are inviting these public comments by the partial recommendation of a prominent WG. Boo hoo! Boo hoo! Boo hoo!


I read all three statements. So let me get this straight. If any RLC member leaves the game for some undetermined period of time, their work and properties are open for reappropriation by anyone. All you need to do is state "I can do it better" and take their name. Do I have your position right? If so, that's a complete crock of shit. I myself left this game for 6 years, leaving behind a wildly successful avatar skins business called Bareskins. So I'm to understand that at any time during my absence you could have decided 1. I was unresponsive to your inquiries, and 2. You could make better skins, so 3. you could take the brand "Bareskins", add a "2" to it, and take over the brand? My goodness, the craveness and egos on the three of you.
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Bad_Timmy
#16 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 11:07:06 AM(UTC)


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And as an aside.. your opinion of the "new" Torture Garden is wildly overinflated. The deco is amateurish 2010-era skills. I'd give it a "2" (ironically) on a scale of 1 to 5. Poor, inconsistent texture usage, no lighting effects, just a huge mishmash of ideas thrown in all willy nilly. It's no improvement on the original.

The original Torture Garden currently has 20 folks there. Your Torture Garden 2 has zero. So good job on that too.
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_leeanne_
#17 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 11:26:32 AM(UTC)


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Originally Posted by: Mrs_Xhris_SD_1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: _leeanne_ Go to Quoted Post
Bahahahahaha open season on naming anything you want #2 I think it is really appropriate.



If any other club decided to name themselves #2 <which there is a club II already that we own> I'd have to demand that they change the name and take proper action if they did not do so. I'm sorry, my husband and I worked hard to build our brand over the 2.5 years we've been open and welcome others to do the same. But not take our name.


I agree wholeheartedly I believe you missed my sarcasm. Calling their club #2 is fitting
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Never_Lost on 1/27/2021(UTC)
Mrs_Xhris_SD_1
#18 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 11:40:44 AM(UTC)

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Originally Posted by: _leeanne_ Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mrs_Xhris_SD_1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: _leeanne_ Go to Quoted Post
Bahahahahaha open season on naming anything you want #2 I think it is really appropriate.



If any other club decided to name themselves #2 <which there is a club II already that we own> I'd have to demand that they change the name and take proper action if they did not do so. I'm sorry, my husband and I worked hard to build our brand over the 2.5 years we've been open and welcome others to do the same. But not take our name.


I agree wholeheartedly I believe you missed my sarcasm. Calling their club #2 is fitting


Oh I got it LOL....just running around on Saturday errands Wink Touche!
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XenithSanguine
#19 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 12:32:12 PM(UTC)


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Originally Posted by: rolichan Go to Quoted Post

oh, and one last thing... you do realize that the rl torture garden fetish club "stole" the name from a really old french book without making their club an exact replica of the book - right? should the copyright holder of the book go after the rl tg club since they're not being true to the book? or better yet, perhaps another group should start a rl torture garden 2 that more closely resembles the book and set up shop next door to the "original" tg?[/color][/font]


Thank you for reading it. I actually didn't know that!

Yes, I invite anyone to create a Torture Garden 3, or even 2. Fantastic idea! Make the club better! Go for it! I just ask that you add some information about aftercare, consent, negotiation etc in the club/book. Least we want another 50 shades of gray esk "BDSM" club on RLC. I am sure we can agree there is enough of that shit here.
"The one thing I will know for certain, is I will never know anything for certain."

- Xenith Sanguine
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XenithSanguine
#20 Posted : Saturday, January 23, 2021 12:37:18 PM(UTC)


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Originally Posted by: SuperDave_1 Go to Quoted Post


"WITHOUT THE CONSENT OR APPROVAL OF THE OWNERS OF THE ORIGINAL CLUB is irresponsible AND immoral."


Cool. Tell me exactly how to get the "consent" form Cleo and I'll do that. Thanks.

Originally Posted by: SuperDave_1 Go to Quoted Post
You want to run a club based on a lack of morals and ethics that's your choice.


Irony to the max.

"The one thing I will know for certain, is I will never know anything for certain."

- Xenith Sanguine
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